Intelligent Atheist and Secular Humanists…?

Oh my goodness! Are there ANY intelligent Atheist or Secular Humanists out there? Ones who REALLY understand Science well enough to argue from something more than talking points and ceaseless claims that Science may one day in the next Millennium be “falsifiable”… even though the hypotheses are currently untestable… and should simply be accepted until some nebulous time in the future when they possibly MAY be able to be tested…? That ain’t Science. That’s RELIGION. Belief in things that are not proved and cannot even be tested in the long-term future constitutes FAITH… not fact….

What part of that is so hard to comprehend…?

NONE of it!!! No Scientist would accept God as fact without proof!!! So… why are Secular Humanists so willing to accept any and every other hypothesis as FACT…?

Confirmation bias…. Dogmatic religious belief….

A lot of people seem to be willing to go through a whole lot of mental and logical… or illogical… and irrational… contortions to escape the authority of God….

Fear must be a powerful motivator….

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11 thoughts on “Intelligent Atheist and Secular Humanists…?

  1. Pingback: Intelligent Atheist and Secular Humanists…? | Wright-Wang Extreme Mystery, Inc.

  2. As a Christian with a science background and an interest in the interface between science and religion I wonder if you have totally understood what falsifiable means to a scientist. Scientists are not supposed to believe theories to be un-falsifiable, in fact if they are, then they are not strictly scientific. For example Popper (who is widely respected as a philosopher of science) claimed that we only make progress in science when we test a theory and find it to be false in some respect. We therefore modify the theory and test again and the new observations we come up with extend our original understanding. Hence for example Darwin’s theory of evolution was found to be partly untrue because it took no account of genetics. When scientists incorporated genetics into his theory it was modified and we started to notice new phenomena that we had not noticed with the original. The same thing has happened with the theory of the atom where Democritus and later Dalton were found to have woefully inadequate theories of the atom, but each test helped us refine the idea. Notice we don’t say atoms therefore don’t exist, but our attempts to falsify the theory take us further.
    Modern theologians similarly test their theories about the Bible, about Jesus and about the nature of the Spiritual world. For example a literalist interpretation of Genesis fails because it doesn’t square with the geological and astronomical evidence for a much older Universe and a much older earth. However when we return to the Bible aware of the bits which have been falsified we start to find new and more helpful ways of looking at Genesis. The falsified bits are rejected and the theory is continually modified as more evidence comes to light.

  3. It’s not a matter of accepting any and every hypothesis as fact, although I’m sure you can find people who are full-on certain about any particular branch of string theory or abiogenesis.

    The concept to consider here is Occam’s razor, which states that, “among competing hypotheses, the hypothesis with the fewest assumptions should be selected.” On one hand, the religious hypothesize an all-powerful, all-knowing god who is deeply concerned about our personal lives, who, depending on your beliefs, either created us as is, ex nihilo, or started the universe ex nihilo. On the other hand, you have any hypothesis arrived to via logical reasoning and accurately reflecting the universe as we currently know it.

    The reason atheists enjoy these hypotheses is because any accepted scientific hypothesis assumes less than a vague god made of infinities.

    • Actually… accepting a ton of assumptions requires more…. God is only vague to those who do not accept him. Who cannot accept him because they are not Chosen. But if you are not Chosen, you cannot understand that. You will never accept any evidence of God as viable. You will choose to accept an infinite number of vague hypotheses instead. That is where you will place your faith.

      And you are certainly entitled to do so. But that is different from proof.

      • It amuses me that you think that hypotheses which have been rigorously studied and which have produced new, useful branches of mathematics and physics are vague, but your god, based off of your subjective feeling and a bible full of contradictions and historical inaccuracies (if not outright falsehoods) is something worth blindly believing in.

        But, I am not chosen, so I will never have the opportunity to avoid hellfire. You are chosen. Your god chose you because he is a loving and compassionate god, who has the capability and knowledge to save everyone, but choses not to. Just you, and a few thousand or million other True Believers ™. Everyone else can burn in hell, because he loves us.

        Out of curiosity, what method do you use to ensure that you’re not being deceived by the devil?

      • I don’t know whether you are Chosen or not. I just know that if you are not Chosen, you won’t understand.

        For 2500 years Euclidean Geometry was accepted as not only truth, but the basis for defining truth. And then we realized it was just plain wrong. At some point, all knowledge will be superseded.

        I don’t ask you to believe what I believe I believe. I’m not trying to push my beliefs on you. But, I realize that unless you are Chosen, you cannot understand. If you are Chosen, at some point you will understand.

        Of ALL created creatures, God loved Lucifer best. He was by far his favorite. But God is Just and Holy….

        I don’t know that you’re damned to Hell. I don’t know I’m right. I am constantly deceived by Satan. I constantly sin. You and I are NO different…. Except that I accept God’s Grace. YOU also have the same opportunity. But… is Just and Holy…. Demanding that God cease to be who he is because you desire him to be something else…. Well… quite a bit of arrogance in that, don’t you think…?

        I don’t know the ultimate purpose of Hell. Maybe it’s purify and make Holy. But I believe that God is not completely understandable to anyone or anything other than himself.

        Historical inaccuracies…? Based on what…? If I may ask….

      • I suppose you believe Newtonian physics is false too, because Relativity came along and improved upon it.

        Assuming your god exists, maybe I’m arrogant in asking him to act like he loves me, but I was faithful for most of my life, and as I frantically searched for a reason to keep my faith over the course of five years, I got silence. I am unwilling to make excuses to explain that silence, just as I am unwilling to make excuses to explain suffering and biblical inaccuracies. One thing is certain, however. If your god exists, he made me this way.

        Historical inaccuracies based on archeology by Israelis who set out to prove their religion right. That’s the biggie, off the top of my head: there was no nation enslaved by Egypt or 40 years in the desert, or 10 commandments. There’s also silly little things like Nazareth being on a hill in the bible, but in a valley in reality. And of course the creation stories are both quite false. No recorded slaughter of children around the time of Jesus’ supposed birth.

        Also, if the belief you’re referring to is my atheism, I do not believe in a god. This is different from believing in no god.

      • I believe Newtonian Physics was the best we had for a long time. But “truth”…? No. And the explanation or “theory” was wrong. Just as General Relativity will eventually proved to be. Newton developed Calculus along with Gauss, which has been and is still useful, but isn’t truth. It’s a useful approximation.

        You might find it useful not to constantly push your ideas on to other people and just attempt to understand what others are saying, rather than forcing your skewed beliefs onto others and creating Straw men to attack.

        God loves you. But… if you expect him to give you what you want when you want it… to give you reassurance… you will be disappointed….

        Are you suggesting that we have access to all the records of Ancient Egypt… or Rome…? That you KNOW precisely the location of Nazareth? That modern Archeology is NEVER off base? That’s just ludicrous. Archeology isn’t even a Science. Neither is History. The “Greatest History Book ever written”… Gibbon’s Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire is full of errors… many based on his interpretations being biased by his position in time and place. He presents the ideas of the Enlightenment as thought they were facts. As becomes known, knowledge changes. You don’t believe the Creation story. That doesn’t make it false. That just means you will tend to be biased against it.

        Not knowing whether there is a god or not is agnosticism, not atheism. Atheism means believing no god exist. Atheism means “no god”. Here is the Google definition: a·the·ism ˈāTHēˌizəm/ noun
        noun: atheism
        1. disbelief or lack of belief in the existence of God or gods.
        synonyms: nonbelief, disbelief, unbelief, irreligion, skepticism, doubt, agnosticism;
        nihilism
        “atheism was not freely discussed in his community”
        You can check other definitions. They all seem to consist of disbelief that any deity exists….

        But… maybe you have a non-standard definition….

        Anyway… if you are God’s… you will find your way back….

  4. Pingback: I am an atheist and I have faith | Jesse Talks Back

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